Week 4 Fiasco

[hellish hellbird]

copied layout from scoprion
*could be changed for adding of more evidence im in a rush sorry* ill put this ** by it like scorpion did
WHAT HAPPENED:

Russia:
the game was played fairly sure alot fo recons were used but it wasnt just one side and as a matter of fact yak was the ones who started using them first...soooo why are we going to rematch it? if anything this battle was the most straight forward noone doing anything bad or thinking about it ingame it was just alot of recons...which is funny certain people want them removed when they fight SO hard for minimap hack and argue "its part of the game".


Kastel:
I recorded sirpimped come out of a wall and try and kill me. People say it was an accident and shouldnt be conisdered him using a glitch...but if you watch the video he was coming from around the center of the building outwards not in the side of the wall. Now if it was an accident why would in the RECORDED video he would: A. jump out from behind me(if i was in first person i wouldnt have seen his name and not known he was there) B.Not notice he walked into a wall from both 3rd and first person you can clearly tell if youve walked into a wall. C.If it was an accident why was he so far into the wall when he came out watch the video hes coming from farther near the middle than near the wall. D.If he was infact in the glitched wall why would he come out and shoot at me to try and kill me...again if i wasnt in 3rd person i wouldnt have seen his name appear in the wall and freaked out. E. you can clearly see he was in the reload animation right as he came out which is the reason he didnt kill me i had enough time to react to both dodge roll( which i did because i expected him to be around the corner not in the wall) and jump back before he shot...had i not seen him he woulda for sure been able to kill me. And maybe F. maybe he got cocky and didnt realize i was recording the fight and figured "why not use this glitch i may or may not have accidentally found they cant report it" or something the last part is me speculating on as to why he would stay so far into the glitch and try to kill me using it every other point you can see in the videos anyder made and just do it yourself too. seriously watch the video he came from near the center area not near the wall ill help you test it if you want too to show how far the range was on his name and where i was.** theres the video. as you can see he was reloading which was the reason he didnt shoot me immediatly**

Harbor:
people complain about the roster constantly which ill adress in the who to blame section
a 212(nico) used a jet trooper in the beginning of the fighting as far as i saw he didnt kill anyone and just died to the tank by the western lz. People debate constatly about shazam being killed...i was right there when he died and there were alot of explosions going off grenades rockets aat lasers iftx missles i cant tell you what killed him as it was havoc but i do know on record i saw a jet missle shoot the tank near the top laser gun and right after a rocket blew it up with mines. now as to shazam dying. lets face the facts he was 1 guy capping the point. i was alive. hond was in the iftz going around the wall to kill both him and the aat. the aat died soon after shazam died leaving him alone. the rocket who killed the tank was alive. we had an atte right next to the base. assuming he some how killed an iftx me as a clone pilot and a rocket while fighting off people constantly spawning at the atte while i think he was a sniper then he must either A. be god or B. be the best player this game has ever had. Now on to the tank parts. I PERSONALLY drove both the tanks (both aats if you are confused) to the repair droid and fixed them up. the first one we got was in the western lz spawn point anyder said he saw it and i know for a fact i was the one who stole it because well i was clearly there. the second was in the crevice which baby eater hond myself and even EPIFIRE said was in the crevice which counters what rage saying MUTLIPLE times the last one was on the mountain what im implying is he wasnt being truthful about what he saw which is obvious and to bring up another point when he "saw" something else(when i get to the kamino point). he may need glasses i wouldnt know but also theres no evidence of a jet trooper taking a tank  even though both rage who said he saw it as a recon and sir pimped accoridng to rage saw it (which he said several times too want the chat logs and the forums posts ill get them for you.) We DO have both a confession from rage and screenshots of him stealing a tank and switching sides when we had a clear 40 man advantage on the ticks. i think this is the worst offense out of any others because it cost us the 40 man lead with that one tank he had 29 kills. with that one jet he had maybe 1. **To clear it up for people who have difficulty counting/ reading( i have dyselxia so its sometimes hard to read text blocks) the tank that died with shazam was not the first tank we took...i mean it died haha. and the screenshots below are places you dont need to jet to.


***show us the screenshots of the jet and the "tank" you claim to have seen***

http://screenshot.xfire.com/s/128798084-3.jpg (screenshot of the first tank i got)
http://www.xfire.com/screenshots/128798085 (screenshot of the second tank i got)
http://www.xfire.com/screenshots/128793327 (screenshot where shazam said he thought rage was also lying)**

Kamino: Theres a forum post where rage said a guy shot through a wall...imo hes just complaining to complain

mustafar: shazam(the ADMIN) was asking to stand on LAVA and asked us if it was a glitch or not....i know jesus walked on water but i doubt any rebel can just STAND on lava...also its a glitch since lava is supposed to kill you in game and in real life. Admin endorsing the useage of glitches

WHO IS TO BLAME:

Russia:
-noone since there isnt a problem

Kastel:
-if it was an accident it was sir pimps fault for not leaving it and trying to kill me using the glitch for suprise( i coulda sworn WUSI trained him better than that but maybe after he left and joined new people he lost all WUSI discipline)

Harbor:
-Nico for being jet, and rage for switching side and stealing a tank to "get back" at one jet. and if there was a problem with the roster scoprion and AND shazam were both there and said nothing about it until AFTER we WON.



WHAT SHOULD BE DONE:

Russia:
-nothing since it was a fair fight

Kastel:
its obivous sir pimped tried to kill me using the glitch by flanking behind me using it had i not been in third person i wouldnt have caught him doing it and i woulda died and noone woulda known what happened. he should be slapped on the wrist or show an example of glitching not being allowed at all accident or not you shouldnt try and kill people if you stumble into one id suggest suspension for X ammount of weeks

Harbor:
Both sides cheated (sorta on the 212 side) Nico and rage should both be suspended from playing for X number of weeks aside from them everyone else played fairly and even though rage cost us 29 kills with the tank(which he cheated to get) and 40 tick lead we still won it

On a side note though shazam should be removed from the admin position for A. conflict of interests since he flipped flopped HARDCORE on us with the who won harbour and russia B. what he said to me in a chatroom with rage when he decided to double team me about the harbour battle and said [08:54] Shazam (scoutz2436): Leave Epifire out of this when i was saying a YAK proved rage wasnt being honest C.hes an admin EDORSING glitching which is really stupid imho

[Phobos]

What went wrong:
- 212 used too many mercs on Harbor and/or 1.0 used too many mercs on Russia
- 212 used jet troopers on Harbor, after being told not to. These jets killed Shazam while he was taking their CP, and also one of our

tanks that was left vacant on the mountain.
- Several people in 1.0 and 212 are to blame, in particular various harrassing/hostile wusi members that claim to be members of both

clans (active participants of more than 1 clan despite oven's rule against this).
see evidence here http://www.swbfgamers.com/index.php?topic=7003.msg75076#msg75076

I think they should be penalized for multiple rule violations and that if YAK is penalized for my one violation (switching teams to take

back tank they stole from us with jet), they (212 and/or 1.0) should also be penalized for each offense as determined by Oven.

A rematch is another option if the admins wish to avoid issuing penalties. I highly recommend that special units are MODDED OUT of

the server mission.lvl for stock maps, this will completely mitigate jet abuse. Funny how they refer to our tanks as theirs.

I also recommend recons are disabled from here on out because they are even worse than special units at ruining the game balance. 

- 1.0/UEF/212 whining and denying they used too many mercs.
- YAK is stronger than 1.0 as proven on maps without tanks/recon spam
- YAK posts the truth unlike anyder
- 212 vixo claims it 'doesn't matter' that a jet killed shazam
- 212 vixo denying a jet took tank

- I wasn't able to take the screenshot in time as I only saw the last second of jet getting in tank from my recon view. I showed

Shazam the spot so if he's going to falsely accuse me of of lying like the other 212 then FC has no need to be in YAK anymore.
- Birdo took one tank from crevice but the first tank that was destroyed was later taken from the mountain, - Vixo also lies about

this by denying the fact jets were used multiple times by 212.
- The extra merc weren't addressed in battle because the 'fake members' were not individually verified by the admins before the

battle started.
- 212 used extra mercs on harbor because several players faking real membership in 212 were identified as members for 1.0
see this thread for proof
as oven says a player can only represent one clan for the tourney (unless their previous clan was eliminiated), a player cannot be in

multiple parcticipating clans unless they count as merc for those other clans. This rule was clearly violated by 212 using 1.0 members

with 'fake 212 tags' and thus proves they used too many mercs on Harbor.
- SirPimped clearly waited until he was out of the glitch to shoot Birdo, and vixo is lying by saying SP tried to kill Birdo from inside the

glitch. SP admitted that the glitch was accidental, 212 is desperate to frame him for cheating though when he obviously didn't.
- Kastel should be replaced with another map.
- YAK has lots of proof of foul play, and 212 too immature to admit it, we have screenshots of too many merc being used, witness

testimony that jets were used multiple times, shazam even said how one killed him while he was CPing which vixo tries to brush off as

'doesn't matter'. If killing our units while they take your base with banned special units doesn't matter, then switching sides to take a

take you stole with jets doesn't matter. At least YAK aren't cowards and admit when we mess up rather than try to supress the

evidence.
- We all know Birdo is lying about stealing both tanks as his claim contradicts itself. He claims to steal both tanks which isn't true,

and in the server he admits he destroyed the first one, and only took a tank from the crevice.
- Majesty is already kicked out of YAK for continual cussing.
- Like BS explains, the tank from mountain was taken by a jet after the other tank from crevice was already taken.
- Birdo only took one tank from the crevice, unless he was the jet who took the second tank from the mountain right above the ice

caves entrance.
- Run around kastel while hugging walls and see how many times you glitch, then come back and lie more about SP glitching on

purpose. SP said he was purposely trying to hug the wall when he accidentally went in a glitch. So he stepped back out and then

resumed combat. How is that cheating? It's not, he never shot at or killed anyone while inside of the glitch. Unless you have proof he

did, then I don't believe any such claims.
- There should be rematch if rules were broken by both teams (which is the case on harbor).
- Anyder posted earlier about UEF members joining 1.0 for the tournament just look through the week 4 thread.
- Recons should be removed IMO because most players agree it ruins the fun. Only being able to win on certain maps due to recon

spam doesn't prove much at all. It is Oven's call though, as I feel special units should be allowed, but several players don't.
- Rematch would make more sense than suspensions but again this is the admins decision.

- Nixo is wrong when he says that Jamman and BabyEater are acting members for 212. This is because Hond and DP already said they

are acting members for 1.0 They cannot be active members for both clans according to Oven. Therefore they were Mercs for 212 on

Harbor. This means 212 used 7 members and 7 mercs on harbor, the ratio is 1:1. There is proof via screenshots.
- It doesn't show much honor that 212 used a jet to steal a tank, and to kill our members when they were CPing. 212 cheated a total

of 3 times on Harbor which is much worse than what I did. Using extra mercs and jets is not tolerable.
- Notice how every single battle YAK won 212 complains? We didn't cheat on mustafar or kastel yet they still complain about it. We

didn't complain about kamino here, so that shows they are the sore losers here not YAK.
- 212 Using too many merc while knowingly ignoring the active partcipants rule set by Oven is a major misdoing and obvious violation

of the rules.

Harbor should definitly be rematch, Russia is up to the admins but probably should also be rematch. Kamino, Mustafar, and Kastel

were fine. 212/1.0 is only accusing us of cheating on the latter 2 because they lost.

- nobody argued for minimap hack, theres no such thing, as far as the regular minimap goes it is part of the game, get over it.
- nobody tried to kill you from the wall, SP left the wall because he walked in by accident.
- he didnt start shooting until out of the wall, period.
- epifire was wrong about the crevice tank being our last, it was 2nd last tank.
- epifire was wrong again when he accused YAK of having no strategy, he was not present at our strategy meeting.

- Not complaining about kamino as I already said, you're lying just to lie birdo. I clearly saw a shot thru the wall, like i said just one sniper shot, im not here trying to write a big paragraph of lies about how someone was trying ot kill me from the glitch am i? Nope. I only saw it once and not blowing things out of proportion like you are.
- Wusi never trained SP to have skill, hes gained more in FC since he joined.

@Re honds post of lies beneath this
SP should not be penalized since he never glitched on purpose
Harbor should go either to yak or rematch due to 1.0 and 212s cheating/lying.

I never lied about a jet stealing a tank, i saw it happen so did sirpimped. Hond is lying again, about me and sripimped. 212 knew 100% they were cheating by using too many mercs and jets

We have eyewitness proof me shazam and sirpimped saw the jets. I have proof 212 used too many mercs, already explained this.

Already explained epifire was mistaken.  Jet was used by 212 not twice, but three times. Hond has clearly been lying and its obvious to the admins

hond lies again when saying shazam was not killed by a jet while cping, many people saw this happen.

We won kastel fair and square, SP left the glitch he accidentally entered and admitted to it. He did not cheat, grow up and stop whining/lying constantly every time you lose hond. The worst offense is denying all the cheats 1.0 and 212 used and rules they broke while lying about YAK and trying to frame SP for something he didn't do. You lot really are the worst bunch of liars I've ever had the misfortune of playing against in a tournament, try reading the rule about active participants before bringing a bunch of tag fakers who don't even know the rules enough to not jet. Stealing our tanks with jet and killing ou CPers with jet you think is fine since you can just deny anything there isn't screenshot proof of, but even with screens proving you used too many mercs you lie nonstop. Its pathetic [/b]

[Oven]

I'm locking the thread in 30 minutes.

[Gen.Hond{snp}]

So is it a contest to see who can write the biggest and longest post? I bet Oven is reading this like a mad man right now. (which is totally understandable) I'm turning into one myself with all of this and so is everyone else... So let the brain damaging continue I suppose   

Lets get this clear first of all at least. I was at the current battles of Russia, Eddies Kastel, Kamino, and Harbour as ElmoTech. Meaning I only was a mercenary once for Harbour which was clearly stated by previous post of ElmoTech being a Mercenary.

1. Kamino was 100% legit correct? There were no complaints besides Majesty's rude comments(just like the rest of the games he/she has been in) and some YAK left during the middle of the game (probably because it wasn't worth fighting for) All good? Yes? Of course NEXT SUBJECT!

2. Eddies Kastel there was only one problem and Birdo caught it in action at the right time. I want everyone to watch this video if they haven't already Stop the video at the 12-13 Second mark(its like between the seconds) and you clearly see SirPimped jumping backwards shooting rockets. Which you can tell Sirpimped did not know Birdo was coming around the corner for him. In the video it also caught SirPimped coming out farther from the wall then he should have if it was a mistake. And if he was hugging the wall he would of noticed the glitch earlier and would of exited right back out. He is also on an angle and comes from behind Birdo thinking he would not notice probably. SirPimped knew Birdo was coming because he had entered the glitch earlier before hand.

3. Russia has only had complaints about the massive Recon spamming and about our roster. Before I even list our roster I want to remind that the Admin(s) should be checking each side if there are to many mercs or not. There were no complaints about using to many Mercenaries by either YAK or the Admins before the battle. So although people can point the finger at a team who is cheating. They should do that before the game starts. After the game we were accused about using to many mercenaries. How ever it wasn't classified in the rules if members of previous ICW3 members can join. We have explained the roster several times but people such as SP and BS still can't seem to get it through their heads. So here it is for like the 5th time.
Russia Match comparison with Mercs and Members.
Mercs: 4
Dirty Harry (212)
FrenchFry (212)
KF
Engel (212)

1.0 members: 14
Wild
Anime
Super
Sammy
Menace
Civic
Jed
"family"
Nico
Erweitert (Anyders brother in 1.0)
Anyder (Member of PRO who is in 1.0 clan)
Troy (Another member for 1.0 in the icw3 who isn't from a previous icw3 clan)
Jumper (Joined after Enten Dropped)
Better Off Dead (Another member for 1.0 in the icw3 who isn't from a previous icw3 clan)

As you see we had enough players for the Mercenaries.  There should be no rematch since it was obviously played fairly and correctly. Shazam even said it himself.

Harbour was a MESS!!!!! We can all agree right? Its just whether of what we all think is worse sort of you can say. Another agreement can we all make is that BOTH sides played unfairly somewhat.
I personally was in this battle and saw what happened. The entire game almost I was in the back western lz command post protecting it and the tanks we acquired.
YAK accused of 212 using a Jet TWICE. I'm 100% sure of a jet being used at least once. His name is Nico and he is younger then most of us and doesn't know the rules well. It was a complete mistake and he switched before either tank came to our CP.
How ever there are several instances Rage/Phobos clearly lied about and I want to make sure its noted. He stated Several times we used a Jet twice and the 2nd time the jet killed Shazam ruining his cping is false. And that the jet used to grab the 1st tank is also false. Here are some quotes on the forum for week 4 that are LIES.

"Wrong again. Nico used jet initially, then later a jet killed Shazam while he was taking CP. Then later a jet took the empty tank on mountain.
Killing a CPer with a jet is 10 times worse than driving a tank out and not killing anyone."  (Quote by Rage page 15) Rage says that a Jet took a tank on the mountain when everyone at the western lz saw it come into our CP and I PERSONALLY saw this happen.

- 212 used jet troopers on Harbor, after being told not to. These jets killed Shazam while he was taking their CP, and also one of our
tanks that was left vacant on the mountain. (Quoted by Rage on this topic) Lies because everyone at the CP saw what happened including the YAK member Epifire.

"birdo might not have been the jet but there was someone who used jet to take the tank on mountain.
using jets is unacceptable especially after being told not to." (Quote y Rage on page 12) Lied because Birdo TOOK both tanks and WASN'T a jet.

"Your team cheated again by killing our players with jets
And then cheated again by stealing a tank with jet." (Quote by Rage on page 16) After Rage took back that tank he killed WAY more then if a jet killed just 1 ticket. Rage lies again about a jet stealing a tank even though everyone saw what happened.

"Biggest thing that pissed me off were our tank pilots all wanting to toss our AATs into their home base. That's what lost YAK the match right there." (Quoted by Epifire on page 6) Epifire saw what we all saw while we were at the western lz.

"I only took the tank that your jet player took. SP and I both saw this happen." (Quote by Phobos page 9) Rage admits he cheated. KNOWING THAT HE DID UNLIKE NICO.

1 of their tanks were toss into our CP and Birdo took it after they jumped out. The other one fell into the crevice which Birdo also took out as explained here.

Gen.Hond{snp}: Did you take the 2nd tank that yak left? And how did they die?
WUSIleader.Birdosrus|>*<|: ya i took it
WUSIleader.Birdosrus|>*<|: it was int he crevice
WUSIleader.Birdosrus|>*<|: rage and someone else drove it there
WUSIleader.Birdosrus|>*<|: they jumped out and died
WUSIleader.Birdosrus|>*<|: the tank was about to die
WUSIleader.Birdosrus|>*<|: i hopped into it healed it a little
WUSIleader.Birdosrus|>*<|: and then drove it to the repair droid
WUSIleader.Birdosrus|>*<|: i think they died
WUSIleader.Birdosrus|>*<|: from jumping into the crevice
WUSIleader.Birdosrus|>*<|: you know that crevice?
WUSIleader.Birdosrus|>*<|: i PERSONALLY took both the tanks

Rage nor anyone else from YAK has any proof of this so called jet. And Vixo is 100% right about there being no way to get that cp. If you want we can set up a match exactly how it was and I dare someone to be able to cp that. You need to be part GOD. Also there is no evidence to prove your point. Shazam even comments this is a picture someone took of him on Harbour. Saying he thought you lied unless you have proof.(which you do not)

What we should do?

Kamino keep it as it is.
Eddies Kastel should have Sirpimped penalized for purposly glitching for 2 weeks.
Russia should have no rematch
Harbour should go back to 212 since of YAK's lies and cheating. Plus if there was a mercenary rule broken it is the Admin(s) fault for not catching it earlier. Rage and Nico should also be penalized for the next 2 weeks. Even though Nico had no idea and Rage knew 100% that he was cheating by switching sides and destroying a tank that costed 212 more reinforcement lost then YAK because of a single jet.

Shazam should step down as Admin since he was obviously being bias and was only agreeing with YAK after he changed his mind several times on the forum. He tried to reschedule Russia even though the problem was settled and wanted to benefit YAK. He also failed to look for the amount of Mercenaries in both Russia and Harbour. At this point he isn't doing any good. There is also a picture on xfire someone already posted about Shazam's opinion on harbour where he thought Rage lied to him.

Majesty as already said should be banned from the ICW3 tournament. (but we all agree anyways on this)

Thanks for reading.

[TheWolf]

eddies kastell, i watched the video, it shows sp exiting by the corner of the building trees on the left building on right. he was not hugging wall whole way down just when he got to corner which he went through,(here is a vid where he shows http://www.xfire.com/video/60ecbb) this is a confirmed accident. no penalties suggested

russia, assuming hond and dp are telling the truth(seems to becoming rare for hond) about wusi being acting members of 1.0 for the war i think a rematch isn't needed. that being said some rules need clarifying i.e. if you are part of a clan that was in the tournament and that clan is no longer in it can you join as a member of another clan for remainder of the war?

harbor definitely needs a rematch as mentioned by previous posts both sides had rules broken. first yak's offense one of our players changed sides and stole a tank he thought was stolen by a jet. now for 212's offenses; they had more mercs than allowed(to be fair to bs, many changed to 212 tags after 1.0 match and could be seen as confusing to anyone watching the match), using jets and yes a jet did kill shazam as he was taking the cp there, there was a jet used further into the match, since no pictures were able to take a pic of it it's a moot point anymore.

majesty has been removed by yak already so no need for you to worry about that.

[Oven]

If you have further remarks, clarifications, corrections, PM them to me as soon as you can. The information from this thread will form the main basis for my decisions, although I'll track down more info if needed by contacting the relevant people and/or posting here.

I will probably reach some decision by tomorrow, but if not, it shouldn't be later than Thursday.

Thank you all again for putting considerable effort into your posts , it has helped greatly and it should result in a better judgement.